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Issue with string/action height
http://www-.luthiersforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10137&t=51547		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Sat Feb 02, 2019 2:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Issue with string/action height
I’ve been playing guitar for 20 years so changing strings and keeping good maintenance has been like 2nd nature, however I have now come across an issue.

My strings started fret buzzing around the 16th fret, so I decided to change the strings and give the guitar a good clean. I hadn’t changed them for over a year so well needed!

However upon re-assembling my bridge and tailpiece, i put my first E string on and tightened and the string now catches on the frets and pickup.

I hadn’t made any alterations to my pickup heights ever or my action heights. Upon cleaning the bridge , i did take the bits out and put them back in (in the same place i took them out) so i am extremely stumped.

I even used the nut to heighten the bridge on the one side and its at its full height but still does not do the job.


Do i need to change the action height? And why after 20 years of using diff guitars has this randomly happened?

Image

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Thanks!


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Author:  Chris Pile [ Sat Feb 02, 2019 4:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Put THE REST of the strings on and get it up to pitch.
Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Sun Feb 03, 2019 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Chris Pile wrote:
Put THE REST of the strings on and get it up to pitch.


The rest of the strings were on and tuned, all strings heights were on the pickup. I just took the photo straight away as i knew it would be an issue with all the strings before putting them on.

Image

Image

I have even tried raising the tailpiece

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Any other thoughts?


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Author:  Chris Pile [ Sun Feb 03, 2019 12:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
OK - in the first group of photos, the bridge thumbwheel shows maybe a quarter inch above the guitar, and in the second group - the thumbwheel is ON the guitar. You did NOT raise the bridge. Raising the tailpiece would not affect your string height.

So, lower your string tension a bit, and crank up the bridge height using the thumbwheel. Don't try to tell me it was at the top, I know better.
Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Sun Feb 03, 2019 1:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Chris Pile wrote:
OK - in the first group of photos, the bridge thumbwheel shows maybe a quarter inch above the guitar, and in the second group - the thumbwheel is ON the guitar. You did NOT raise the bridge. Raising the tailpiece would not affect your string height.

So, lower your string tension a bit, and crank up the bridge height using the thumbwheel. Don't try to tell me it was at the top, I know better.


The bridge height was full at the top originally as in the first picture correct. I also put all the strings on after that picture, so i took all but the 6th string off and moved the bridge back down and raised the tailpiece to test (which made no difference)

The bridge and tailpiece until now for the last 8 years of having the guitar have always been flush to the bottom


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Author:  Chris Pile [ Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Done here. Thanks for playing.
Author:  Conor_Searl [ Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Yeah, I think your issue may just be the bridge is too low. I find it easy to accidentally raise or lower the bridge when the strings are off and your cleaning things up. Its also super easy to lose perspective about where everything was before you started. Once things are set up the way you like them take measurements, that way next time if something goes sideways or mysterious buzzes appear you at least have something to measure against to help maintain perspective.
Author:  Mark Mc [ Sun Feb 03, 2019 2:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Yes, the bridge definitely looks too low. Something changed the height setting while you disassembled it or cleaned things. See what you can do to raise the bridge height using the wheels. Or take the bridge off again and reassemble it with careful attention to how the bridge engages with the threaded rods.
Author:  Photoweborama [ Mon Feb 04, 2019 8:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
This is just basic setup stuff.

Put strings on and tune. Check neck relief, than adjust string height at the 17th fret so there’s a 5/64” space between the fret and low E, and set the treble side at 4/64”. Then check intonation.

Done!


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Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Conor_Searl wrote:
Yeah, I think your issue may just be the bridge is too low. I find it easy to accidentally raise or lower the bridge when the strings are off and your cleaning things up. Its also super easy to lose perspective about where everything was before you started. Once things are set up the way you like them take measurements, that way next time if something goes sideways or mysterious buzzes appear you at least have something to measure against to help maintain perspective.


I shall redo it and get back to you thanks. I always take photos of when i do anything, and the bridge has always been right at the bottom, but will try again


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Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Feb 04, 2019 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
[/quote]the bridge has always been right at the bottom[/quote]

Hmm, I think we have found the problem.
Author:  Bryan Bear [ Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
I'm not an electric guy at all so forgive what is likely to be a stupid question. Is the bridge on backwards? I see some pictures of bridges where the intonation adjustment screws are on the back and some on the front. Where were they before you started?
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Mon Feb 04, 2019 11:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Bryan, that is normal.
Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:48 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Barry Daniels wrote:
the bridge has always been right at the bottom[/quote]

Hmm, I think we have found the problem.[/quote]

How do you mean? All the other Les Pauls i have seen, have the bridge at the bottom




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Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 3:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Bryan Bear wrote:
I'm not an electric guy at all so forgive what is likely to be a stupid question. Is the bridge on backwards? I see some pictures of bridges where the intonation adjustment screws are on the back and some on the front. Where were they before you started?


It is that way for a reason which is silly as you can adjust the action with the screws that way around!




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Author:  Barry Daniels [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
TheKillerQueen wrote:
How do you mean? All the other Les Pauls i have seen, have the bridge at the bottom


Raise up the bridge to raise the action. Are your trolling us or is this a dumb question.
Author:  Chris Pile [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Quote:
Are your trolling us or is this a dumb question.


Trolls are usually dumb, so yeah...
Author:  Barry Daniels [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Chris, I was actually asking if my question was dumb, but I get your point.
Author:  TheKillerQueen [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 12:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Barry Daniels wrote:
TheKillerQueen wrote:
How do you mean? All the other Les Pauls i have seen, have the bridge at the bottom


Raise up the bridge to raise the action. Are your trolling us or is this a dumb question.


I am not trolling at all. The bridge was raised in my first pictures which is why i was asking.


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Author:  Freeman [ Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Issue with string/action height
Killer, for what its worth, I have a habit of every time I work on a guitar, doesn't matter whose or what kind or what I am doing with it, I measure literally everything and write it down before I touch anything. I can tell a lot from those numbers about what needs to be done and I can often tell a lot about what the player likes (or I can say something like "are you happy with ....." I actually have a little spreadsheet that I use - not all of the boxes get filled out on every guitar but having it in front of me reminds me to look at them. One of the the things I measure is the heights of the saddles above the top (that not only tells me things about the action, it might indicate some structural issues).

When I am done working on the guitar I remeasure everything (and have some little boxes in the spreadsheet for them too). Lastly, different adjustments on a guitar may affect others, while some may not. For example, changing the relief almost always changes the 12th fret action and may change the 1st fret action very slightly. Changing the action does not change the relief. Changing the action affects intonation, changing intonation (compensation) does not change action.
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